By Captain Oats (Jestergoblin) on Tuesday, January 15, 2008 - 11:46 pm:

Is there a difference between the Force and mana?

I'm laying the groundwork for another set or six. (I'll have time again this semester for Magic).

The Force is something all living things are capable of being sensitive to, along with some inanimate objects I believe. I'm not that well versed in Force Lore.

By Homelands Bookie (Psycho) on Wednesday, January 16, 2008 - 04:28 am:

There is no Force.

By Captain Oats (Jestergoblin) on Wednesday, January 16, 2008 - 10:47 am:

I hate you, Psycho.

By Squeeman (Squeeman) on Wednesday, January 16, 2008 - 12:44 pm:

I think the only unquestionably canonical info about the Force is in the movies. Lots of books and guides have been written about Star Wars stuff, but those can always be changed by a new movie.

So watch the two trilogies and take notes. And maybe play Jedi Knights or some other Star Wars video games. Those tend to give you the names of the various Force abilities.

By Captain Oats (Jestergoblin) on Wednesday, January 16, 2008 - 01:01 pm:

But is being able to tap into the force the same as tapping mana?

In Magic, it's explained that some people unconsciously tap into mana, such as gardeners with a good green thumb. While in Star Wars, Han Solo unknowningly taps into the Force to make absurd shots and is seen as "luckier."

By Nathan (N810) on Wednesday, January 16, 2008 - 01:17 pm:

I'm thinking taping for mana would
be more like powering up in dragonball Z

not the yelling part (well maybe the red mages)
but the effect on their surroundings (wind or floaty rocks)
yea that bit.

By Puschkin (Puschkin) on Wednesday, January 16, 2008 - 04:00 pm:

I would have kind of agreed that the force is used similarily to mana after seeing just the first trilogy (aka Episode 4-6).
But somewhere in Episode 2 or 3 they decided to reveal that "The Force" is actually a bunch of micro bacillus thingies ... which was such as stupid move beyond description.

So I guess if you made a card game out of that you might want to represent the force differently. Taming your own private flea circus just isn't like tapping into mana and drawing it from vast planes.

Oh and I hate Psycho, too. With passion.

By Captain Oats (Jestergoblin) on Wednesday, January 16, 2008 - 05:06 pm:

No, midi-chlorians are what allows someone to use the force, not the source of the force itself. They are endosybiotic organisms, similar to our own mitochondrion (My mom's a biology professor).

By Homelands Bookie (Psycho) on Thursday, January 17, 2008 - 12:36 pm:

Well... I hate your mom!

By Super Ultra Mech (Jestergoblin) on Thursday, January 17, 2008 - 10:11 pm:

Thanks Psycho, thanks.

*bolts your pony*

By Squeeman (Squeeman) on Friday, January 18, 2008 - 07:15 am:

Your pony hates your mom's face's pony.

By Homelands Bookie (Psycho) on Friday, January 18, 2008 - 07:31 am:

Yeah!

By Nathan (N810) on Friday, January 18, 2008 - 07:43 am:

Hey you two take it to the 7th Sphere...

lol :P

By Super Ultra Mech (Jestergoblin) on Friday, January 18, 2008 - 08:17 am:

I actually had a legitimate question too.

By Squeeman (Squeeman) on Friday, January 18, 2008 - 09:42 am:

Wasn't it more or less answered, though? If all else fails, look it up on Wikipedia and pretend that you've got genuine, reliable information at your disposal.

The Force

Force Powers

Only Fools And Horses

By Super Ultra Mech (Jestergoblin) on Friday, January 18, 2008 - 09:57 am:

I read those. Wookiepedia is better though.

I guess the force is kind of like mana...

By Squeeman (Squeeman) on Friday, January 18, 2008 - 10:40 am:

Is this for your "Deckmasters" project? If so, then there's not really any problem changing "mana" to "Force" except that you'd have to use words other than "summoning" etc, what with the Force not being able to summon Han Solos by the dozen.

By Super Ultra Mech (Jestergoblin) on Friday, January 18, 2008 - 09:09 pm:

Yes, it is for that project.

It's just weird, because I'm trying to do color breakdown.

The light side is blue-white I think, while dark side is black-red. But what about the species (notice how this comes back to the whole species vs home vs profession vs personality)

By Troy Aguilar (Troy) on Thursday, September 18, 2008 - 07:50 pm:

This might be a little late, but better now than ever right?

Only a select few have the spark to beocme a person who actully use's mana.
And even fewer ignite the spark.
While the force, along with jedi, are more numerous.

But creatures i guess, since we summon and control the creatures we play.
and jedi can tame the minds of a beast if they are skilled enough.

And we also use sorcerys and spells.
Like jedi and sith, who use force lighting, force push and pull, force choke. etc...

And this deckmaster's project, are you still working on it?
Provide a link for it?

By Adrian (Zaechs) on Wednesday, October 14, 2009 - 12:46 am:

K, just got to this rather late, lol. And I find just a few things that might need to be clarified.

First, troy I think you may be mistaken, correct me if I am wrong. Planeswalkers have the spark. Spellcasters, mages, wizards, and sorcs do not need the spark to use mana, or magic in the realm of MtG. Mana is created through the refining of one's memory, looking into ones past and forming tangible energy from these thoughts. The limitation, much like the force, is based on ones own body, and mind. If one cannot handle, or rather comprehend the use of mana, then they cannot cast a spell.

The force and mana would be much the same, but the kicker comes in the form of "acceptable expectations." The force is very localized as far as evocation and summons are concerned, and far reaching with its form of divination. If you play D&D, these terms are familiar.

Mana however, is raw, and epic scaled. Where in MtG one can create a field burst fire ball, as many spellcasters have in the story, or rather similar "AOE spells." Whilst the force has few able to reach such a feat of evocation or summoning. Perhaps in divination, or other non-combative/ethreal abilities, but nothing on the scale of MtG.

This is unless you are looking at the player as a true Force-Guru. Perhaps the first of a new breed of force adapt that are able to transcend (much like a Star Gate sense), or reach "Force-Nirvana." In which case, most force wielders that they would summon pale in comparison, and there would be no "Forcewalkers" as cards (just to enter the story, and mechanics).

But this is also just my two cents, and random speculation.

One last thing. Do not limit one side to a color. But rather, limit personality and ability function to coenside with the character, or power and the appropriate color.

IE: Force Lighting = Black, Han Solo = Blue/red, etc.

By Homelands Bookie (Psycho) on Wednesday, October 14, 2009 - 07:08 am:

Thanks for the 2 cents, Adrian. But I fear everything you aimed at Troy is wasted, since he kind of disappeared about half a year ago.

But on the bright side, come play 4CB with us!

By JG (Jestergoblin) on Wednesday, October 14, 2009 - 09:12 am:

Adrian,

This is more about how to let the force manifest itself within the established card mechanics.

A project I've played around with on and off is what I've called the "Deckmasters Project." The premise is based off of modding video games. You take the core gameplay but bend it to fit a new universe. It would essentially treat the rules of Magic as the source code. Kind of like Half-Life and Counter-Strike.

As for the limiting sides to a color... I've written at length the debate about determining color in the past.

Should races be color bound? How about professions? Personality? Where they grew up? It's very complicated. For example, is Gerrard white because he's a solider? Or is it because he's from Benalia? Or is it his willingness of self-sacrifice?

What if he was a warrior from Shiv - would that make him red? Where is the division then? What if he just happened to be an elf instead of a human, would that make him green?

By Adrian (Zaechs) on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 01:57 pm:

What exactly is 4CB, Mr. Bookie?

And I figured, this long after your post you would have realized most of this, but it was one of those late nights and didn't pay attention to thread age, lol. Sorry. But I agree on your points on the color debate, where does one draw the line.

Honestly, I would look at what time in MtG history, not the canon story, but the actual game's history- you are looking to base your set on, and how to tweek from there.

I am sure you came to that conclusion as well, but it never hurts to look back to that once more. This will influence the percentage of color to color, and type to type hopefully enough to afford the color balance required.

Urza's went with a no gold idea, and played along the long lived idea that it is based upon one's starting mana, or color based on birth, and then the color mastery one has. A for instance: Gerrard is white because he is from Benalia. Before the advent of now over-abundant tribal systems, he was a soldier because he was a soldier, not because of his color. I direct you to master of arms. He is also legendary, and thus type is not color restricted, often, legends brake the mold, or the other extreme, become the epitome of the color (Ascendant Evincar, or Greven Il-Vec).

You then have those like many of the legends out there that have multiple colors due to mastery. Some few have regional multicolor as demonstrated in the invasion cycle, but otherwise, multi-colored creatures, or rather legends are the result of color mastery. Nicol Bolas for instance. Unsure of his true origins, it can be surmised that he is a master of all three colors, red, black, and blue. (I use him only because he has returned in recent years and refreshed in memory)

This is the system I use for the card sets that I am currently working on. But then again, I am a fan of anything Pre-Onslaught, and love to use the older systems of types, naming, and abilities, lol.

I might just even begin a thread in order to get some feed back, lol.

By Wicked Darkman (Wickeddarkman) on Tuesday, October 27, 2009 - 04:15 am:

4cb is a game we play in one of the other spheres in here!

You basically pick 4 cards to be your entire deck!
then a tournament is hold using these decks!

There are more details to it though, but thats the basis!

By Homelands Bookie (Psycho) on Tuesday, October 27, 2009 - 05:00 pm:

Here's the link to the active 4CB thread.

By JG (Jestergoblin) on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 08:33 am:

You know that link doesn't include the RULES for 4CB, right?

By Puschkin (Puschkin) on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 09:52 am:

The rules are easy:
WD tries to metagame and manipulate the evolution, then fails miserably. In the end the one who is best at kissing Psycho's ass gets the most style points. Then we start complaining about everything and when we are finished, a new round starts.

Meh, it's about time to satrt a new thread anyway.

BTW, Adrian, it would be a good time to join, the deck I submitted for this round is really weak.

By Homelands Bookie (Psycho) on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 12:44 pm:

Well said Puschkin, that about sums it up.

I'll go make a deck now. And post a link to the rules.

By Homelands Bookie (Psycho) on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 12:47 pm:

Here are the rules of 3CB which is the same as 4CB only 25% less fun.

By Bwm Wil Mindctrl (Bwm) on Friday, October 30, 2009 - 03:40 am:

Back on topic, HERE's a link to a webcomic featuring the force